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Hot Threads: Divas on a Bus, Missteps of Honor, Making an Ohio Valley Impact, Rocky's Road To Survivor Series, and More

By Corey Letson Nov 17, 2011 - 7:45 AM print


It's time for another look at the free Wrestling Insanity Message Boards, with your host, "The Great White Dope" Corey Letson ...


Welcome one and all to the weekly "Best of" The World Wrestling Insanity Message Boards. Here at Hot Threads we aim to give you the cream of the crop when it comes to our fabulous residents. We'll be spending time jumping from the WWE to TNA to almost anything in the 'verse.

WWE has started the countdown timer on the launch of their new network. And luckily they're giving their loyal viewers the ability to have some input. What kind? Well, by letting us name the shows they've already decided to air. Now I'm not saying all these shows will happen but they're throwing out non-denial denials that say “Look, let's say we did this show. Not saying we are, but if we were...what would you like us to call it? Seriously, I'm not even saying we're going to make the damn thing. We have 24 hours of programming to make a day. Do you know how hard it's going to be to write 168 hours of original television a week for our network? Hell, even if we spend forty hours a week showing old footage we still have to cut out anything about Benoit. That takes man hours. So don't judge us. Anyways, seriously can you help us name this shit?” So with all of that going down how do they expect to actually fill the time?

 

ZAH

Just saw some more ideas for WWE's future television channel (though, some I've seen already):

*A show with Steve Austin and a more high-brow beer taster going around the country sampling beer.
*Mick Foley going around the country to amusement parks and checking out the rides
*Mick Foley hosting a show with the craziest moments in WWE history like the insane high risk moves of himself, Jeff Hardy, Shane McMahon and others.
*The Big show and wife Bess reality show, showing off her cooking talents and him showing off his eating talents as well as life at home.
*A reverse biggest loser, in this case it's skinny guys who work with a WWE performer to add muscle to their bodies and try then get girls.
*A fitness show with various WWE men and women stars where you go go the gym with them and they demonstrate their workouts and give nutritional advice.
*Divas on the road in a tour bus.

Honestly...a couple of these shows I'd absolutely watch.

 

PeterDawson

Well the Diva tour bus thing is happening and I can buy some fitness shows for sure. I'd actually love to see JR get a weekly show called JR's BBQ where he and some old guys sit around cooking meat and talking about that week in WWE. Beer tour works, but Foley... kind want to see him do a comedy thing now that he does stand-up.

 

The Chosen 1

I'd watch them too but it just seems that 24 hours a day, 7 days a week, is A LOT of programming....

How easy is going to be to be burned out on a channel that is nothing but WWE 24 hours a day, even if you like certain shows

-----

What's going to happen on Monday Nights from 9-11 and Fridays 8-10? Simulcast? Or a black screen? I can't see them competing with themselves? I can also see them replaying the shows immediately afterwards... and about 30 times during the week. What about PPV's, wouldn't WWE lose money to show a PPV that otherwise would cost $40-50 a month, if they show them on the Network? Or does this mean the Network's going to cost a shit load of money every month to even that out?

Will the majority of these shows air for the first time during primetime hours, on Tues/Wed/Thurs/Sat?

What else will they show? Old DVDs?

 

Aaron Wood

I would wager, and it might be smart to do, if they hooked up with a shopping channel to go from, say 1am-7am every night, or indeed, had such paid programming. with infomercials.

I can't fathom there will be WWE programming on at that time. It'd be crazy for no return. And hey, that's six hours and thus 1/4 of a day less to programme.

In terms of PPV, I'd imagine they'd do a deal similar to how and when movies make the move from cinemas to PPV and the DVD market. Pretty much how I believe 24/7 works now. 6-8 weeks after the show, they'll premier the PPV on the Network and run re-runs as and when necessary.

And while there will be programming against RAW & Smackdown, it'll just be some lame duck shit. Maybe Experience & Bottom Line/Afterburn of that previous week.

I mean, they have 35000 of wrestling footage alone that can use that already has been digitised for the Network's use. They have 100000 hours of tape libraries in total. That's over 11 years (if my maths is right) of footage they can first run alone already. Not counting anything they make.

As for those shows, in the UK, we had something very similar to the Austin show already. Foley's amusement park thing sounds cool, and I'd have thought an OMG show was a given. I'd have thought 24/7 had something akin to it already. The "reverse Biggest Loser" show sounds like something MTV would do for dorky kids. And the fitness show sounds smart, given the physical nature of the artform.

There's another one that was reported that Zah hasn't listed in a show looking at the ringcrew and production trucks travelling the road, in a "Ice Road Truckers" kinda way, which would interest me, since I have more than a passing interest in that side of things.

It's just a shame they let Gail Kim go, otherwise they could have paid Robert Irvine a truck of cash to do shows for them.

 

The Chosen 1

Well I guess if they have 11 years of original footage then they probably will be fine. lol

I hope they do a thing where they will just have a block of two hours every week they show an entire random episodes of RAW/Smackdown!/Nitro/etc.. from the past, like syndication. From Mon-Fri @ say 3pm-5pm just show five consecutive RAW's from 1998. Then the next week from 1993 and so on.

Is there a list of all the promotions in history that WWE owns the entire library to? Or is it really just basically everything but NWA post 1992/TNA/ROH/ and any other company that's currently alive?

----

You know what would be awesome....They should bring back the Hardcore title and LEGITIMATELY have it be on the line 24/7 haha, have them claim that the Hardcore champion will be followed by a camera crew 24/7 like a reality show and either be able to "break into" (but not really) shows that are currently going on to cut to a title defense in progress, or have it be a daily or weekly reality show that deals with his defenses or the threats to his belt over the week and have the Reality Show be based on how different people deal with the pressure of being the champion.

 

RowdyRodimus

I like the JR idea, but just to tweak it a bit, have them tell road stories instead of that weeks WWE programming. This way they can put a lot of shows in the can at once and not have to be under the gun from week to week, plus they'd be a lot more interesting. Say one week have JR's Cookout (or whatever it would be called) have the Armstrong family on talking about Bob's days through Roaddog's, etc.

As for home shopping, I can see them doing their own version of it with current and former stars hosting blocks of it shilling their own stuff. Get DDP to host a few hours a week (he just seems like he'd be a natural at it) and Zach Ryder who also seems like he'd be good at it. Have some current and former talent as guests every show and take live calls from random people who are ordering and you have a pure moneymaking homerun.

 

Average

Wrestling "news" is going to suck when the websites start reporting on a 24-7 WWE network.

SCSA talks shit in a brewpub.
Divas bicker on a bus.
Blah blah blah.

 

James Guttman

Good point, Average. I can co-sign that.

"WWE NEWS: What WWE wrestler is drinking beer on TV?"

On a side note, I can't tell what I think of this idea. On one hand, I couldn't care less about watching wrestlers be reality stars and actors. Watching Austin do a beer show is no different than watching anyone else do it. It's banking on the cult of personality where wrestling fans will tune into a show that has nothing to do with wrestling just because a wrestler is in it. I could see them having to do a major overhaul on the entire format.

That said, it makes more sense to do original programming because straight wrestling 24/7 in a world of Youtube would be dumb. I don't need to wait until a certain day and time to watch old ECW footage because I can watch whatever I want online immediately. So I get that and can see why they wouldn't want to just dump their tape library onto TV. Yet, I can't shake the feeling that the original programming they're going for is going to be pretty pointless and won't appeal to many of the hardcore fans who would be in the target audience.

That's not to say people won't order. The entire network could be a 24/7 picture of the WWE logo and they'll still get more subscribers than some other networks. Just in terms of maximizing its potential, I don't know if Divas on a bus is going to do it.

 

Mike Johns

For the record, I have ZERO interest in the Divas on a Bus show. The one guy around here who COULD have had it, doesn't.

If anything, I might just barely give the Big Show reality show a look, because I kind of like the guy and think he's legitimately funny. Plus, I can remember some hype segments WWE did with him and his wife a couple years ago and thought it was cool. It was him and Bess in their kitchen talking about how badly he beat up someone. Not much to it, but certainly different.

And Possibly the Surreal Life clone with the WWE Legends. Mostly because I really liked the Surreal Life, and they might get some cool legends on the show.

Keep in mind, reality TV isn't my gig, so this isn't me knocking the network. I'm just adding more or less to JG's point that WWE's missing the boat on its target audience with these weird reality shows. You'd think that if you're having a network geared toward wrestling fans, you'd want to program things they'd want to see. The workout shows make sense. Highlight shows might get tedious, but also make sense. Clip Shows (like I Love the 80) would be an idea to run with, but may also get tedious.

My thing is, do you want to run a network that appeals to the fanbase, whoever you believe that base is or should be at this point (and, with a lot of these programming choices, it seems, at least to me, as if WWE has ZERO idea who their audience is and what they want to see, simply because these show ideas sound like people throwing stuff at a wall and seeing what sticks), or, do you, once again, want to spend way too much money creating a launchpad for WWE talent to attempt (and fail) to become crossover celebrities like the Rock? Because that's what this is sounding like to me. Like the WWE Originals album, or any WWE Film, where they spend this shitton of money to produce something so bad, it pretty much proves why X person should really stick to wrestling because they can't act/sing.

 

TheGreatWhiteDope

Booker & Goldust at the movies must happen. A weekly movie review show starring Goldust and Booker would be GOLD

 

PeterDawson

Actually that is a pretty good idea, having something like a movie review show. Just get two quirky guys, like Booker and Goldust as suggested, and it should ideally be entertaining.

Hell, their show opposite Raw should just be Booker T and Dusty Rhodes watching Raw and making their usual insane commentary.

 

Yep, we're going to be talking about this whole WWE Network (do they have an official name for it yet?) or whatever they call it for awhile. Needless to say I can't wait to see how many cheap plugs of the new WWE Network happen as we get closer to Wrestlemania. I'm wondering if they can match the plugs for the network against how many times they plug Twitter verbally on-air. With Foley being back out cheap-plugging him is going to be a triumph all its own.

 

If you don't understand my comment on the Twitter plugs you haven't been watching Raw for the past month or so. There was a section of a previous Hot Threads devoted to the discussion of Twitter on WWE television. In my assumption it hit almost critical mass this past Monday with almost every talking segment involving “Twitter-verse” or “Here is my Twitter handle” said aloud ad nauseum. But I understand and can personally move on from the schilling into the more important matter for WWE this week. The Rock returns to action THIS SUNDAY! Of course if you follow WWE's product or wrestling in general you've known that since mid-August. We finally hit a head though. The Rock “rocked” Raw this week. After building this match for the past three weeks The Rock finally showed up to build the tension to the max. How did people feel after Raw went off the air? How about Miz and R-Truth's actual shot to not look like curtain jerkers? You remember that DX vs Other people Survivor Series match when Mike Knox got knocked out in three seconds and DX then joked about it for a few minutes? Anyone else get the feeling Miz&Truth vs Rock&Cena is going to end exactly like that?

 

PeterDawson

Wow, they're seriously going to try and book The Rock as the heel... Then again in spite of what I said earlier no way Cena's turning unless Rey Mysterio returns. As much as some of us mock the guys who are only cheered by horny women and little kids the lack of a good role model for them (which Punk, in spite of not doing any drugs and such, sadly isn't) with Mysterio out means Cena must remain a face.

 

JohnnyCraze

If they try and make Rock heel already....5 and 1/2 months before WM, won't that take a little steam and interest out of Rock and Cena's match at WM? I wouldn't turn any of them heel.....yet.

 

The Chosen 1

If anything I had the feeling Cena was more Heelish.... He started the shit with Rock tonight and talked about how Rock failed to understand that they needed to co exist meanwhile hes the one who brought Rock in to be his partner only to start shit with him then get mad hes not on his side... Pretty douchey

That said... Even if Rock or Cena ends up on top at the end Cena has gotta be losing to Miz or Truth during the match itself simply because when EVERYONE thinks one outcome is the ONLY outcome.... So long as it doesn't back them into a corner, They do the opposite. Just for the shock value.

 

Sprout1883

Does it matter what they do with Rock & Cena. It will be forgotten about until the Rumble, when God knows what WWE will be thinking or how many times they have changed their mind

 

PeterDawson

I'm very mixed on this Raw as it really feels like most of the 'big' segments were a waste of time, specifically the Cole challenge and This is Your Life. The only reason I can see for the challenge was Punk gives Cole the vice, which was refreshing yeah but the segment really felt pointless and was even acknowledged as such. The This is Your Life thing was... interesting, but again, pretty long with very little pay-off. Still the This is Your Life thing could pay off more if it became poignant somehow (heel turns, more people from Cena's past appearing to say he's a bad man or the people that boo him suck), but I still don't see the point of the Cole challenge.

 

Small credit to WWE before we move on…”This is Your Life” was exactly what it needed to be for Foley and Cena. Basically Cena came off just as corny and a lot worse. The Rock's Rock Bottom to Foley was one of the few times I've ever laughed out loud thanks to something on WWE Television in a long, long time.

 

ROH isn't talked about a lot on the WWI Message Boards but when discussed it's nothing short of an interesting conversation. Over the past few weeks a few members of the Insanity have discussed ROH's pitfalls. This, thanks to the cult-like fanbase, isn't something that is ever regularly mentioned. Yes, ROH messes up sometimes. They have storylines that fall flat or just bad gimmicks. James Bullock even hosted an “Honor Nation” on ClubWWI about the subject. It all started with ROH getting rid of a ranking system, something every wrestling company tries at one time or another, and not even giving a reason.

 

Mike Johns

Now, this is going to be a stupid question, as this has likely been addressed on an ROH show I didn't see, but.... did they abolish the Pick 6?

 

TheGreatWhiteDope

Without ever saying a word

 

Mike Johns

In other words, no.

List of things ROH should not have been allowed to get away with:
1. Special K
2. Christopher Daniels being the top heel solely because he didn't shake peoples hands.
3. Tyler Black losing at Final Battle 2009
4. Not even trying to explain how or why the Pick 6 no longer exists.

 

James Bullock

Pretty much after "Death Before Dishonor 8" when Davey got his shot and Roderick became the number one contender, they didn't even bother since it's mess up their main event storylines.
And Mike, you can add the "Larry Sweeney-Bobby Dempsey-Allison Danger 'rape' segment" to your list.

 

TheGreatWhiteDope

Did they ever put that segment on DVD?

 

James Bullock

Yep, on the "6th Anniversary Show". I actually did a review of the show for the site, and here's what happened in the segment via my Worth Your Money review:

It's time for the Larry Sweeney Show Starring Larry Sweeney. Even though Bobby Dempsey was with him, Mr. Dempsey wasn't his guest for the evening. Sweeney's guest was ROH original, Allison Danger. Sweeney talked about the greatness of Danger…on her knees! Sweeney proclaimed her a slut, awhore, and everything except a child of God. Danger was furious, storming off after giving Sweeney a rebuttal that defended her lady-like honor, and how she kick started the women's division in ROH. Before Danger could leave, Sweeney cracked her in the back of the head with his microphone. The fans began to buzz as Sweeney looked at Dempsey. Sweeney told Dempsey it was time for him to become a man by having sex with the unconscious Allison. Dempsey refused, so Sweeney clubbed him too; causing Dempsey to fall on top of Danger. Dempsey tried to get up, but Sweeney held him down on top of Danger, trying to force him to become a man by forcibly gyrating Dempsey's large him. It was like a silver whale trying to roll into the water, but a guy forcing you to have sex is stopping you. Sweeney, holding Dempsey down with his foot, proclaimed that tonight was the beginning of his takeover of ROH by getting any, and every, contract he wants from any member of the roster.


In reality, it wasn't that bad compared to things like Katie Vick from a visual aspect. But for ROH fans, it was blasphemy that the only way to get heat for Sweeney (as if he needed it) was to do something outrageous like simulated attempted forced rape. Really the only blemish on an otherwise wonderful show.

 

Mike Johns

List of things ROH should not have been allowed to get away with:
1. Special K
2. Christopher Daniels being the top heel solely because he didn't shake peoples hands.
3. Tyler Black losing at Final Battle 2009
4. Not even trying to explain how or why the Pick 6 no longer exists.
5. Larry Sweeney forcing Bobby Dempsey on Allison Danger

Completely did not think of that one. Sort of before my time with ROH. Although I do remember quite a few people giving them shit over it at the time.

Allison Danger even went out of her way to try and defend the segment on a shoot DVD. I try and ignore she did that, because... seriously, simulated rape on a wrestling show that fans actually cheered for. Yeah, it sucks for Bobby Dempsey, I guess, but you got the wrong reaction. You know you got the wrong reaction, and I don't remember Allison or Bobby ever actually giving Larry a proper comeuppance after that. Hell, you'd think they'd have forced Larry to pull a Raven post-Sandman crucifixion for that, had the audience not cheered it like a bunch of jackasses.

Guys, the proper reaction to a guy being pushed on a woman is to tell Larry Sweeny to knock it the fuck off. Not tell Bobby to "get him some!"

 

TheGreatWhiteDope

Says something about the ROH crowd really....

...When it comes to Daniels being top heel for not shaking hands....I think, at the time, it was completely justified. It was a company based on honor, respect, and atheletism. Basically it opened up how Evolve is now. Is that a good thing? Eh, they survived it either way. They also drifted away from it being a gigantic deal after the first year and a half? So at the time, I'm sorry. That one should totally be taken off the list.

As for Black....well..I just don't think Pearce fully understood when something would be burnt if it simmered any longer. Plus, he just got the company like 3-4 months prior right?

 

Mike Johns

In the context of ROH at the time or not, that concept was something that completely turned me off to the company when I first heard of it circa 2003. I wasn't the only one. To the ROH crowd, I get why you guys defend this, in context, but it's also one of the concepts that kept ROH from beating TNA when they had a legit chance in the early years.

As for Black - Pearce was relatively new, but after Black lost at manhattan mayhem 3, it's hard to see how anyone could think Tyler could survive one more loss. Seriously, I saw that show, and I'm amazed the ROH fans didn't turn on Black then when he blew that shot, which was, like, what, his 5th? Maybe in the trenches, it looked different, but I can't see how anyone watching this show at the time couldn't have completely given up on Black after Final Battle 2009.

 

Exx

What was wrong with Special K? I thought it was a fun gimmick and a good way to use undercard talent.

The thing about Daniels was that they were treating ROH as a nerd workrate promotion and Daniels was for the most part the only one breaking the rules.

An addition to your number 4 could be why the number one contenders trophy was gotten rid of with no explanation too. At least I dont remember one.

 

James Bullock

The main problem I, like many others, had with Special K was the fact most of the guys weren't ready for the position they were put in (mainly during their huge push against the Carnage Crew). They were a bunch of flippy guys with a gimmick that had a short shelf life. Once they splintered the group, it was pretty much identified who had talent and who didn't. So ROH spent over a year building up a group where only three guys out of a dozen were good.

Daniels didn't really cheat, though. He would do a few underhanded things, but most of, if not all of his matches during that time were won pretty fair. As for not following the Code of Honor, it actually worked in favor for Daniels because Philly loves the anti-hero.

And you can add the contender's ring, the top five, and all the other #1 contender set ups ROH has had since its inception, and never explain why they got rid of it.

 

Exx

I guess I saw Special K as giving a gimmick to guys who would have been nothing more than jobbers otherwise.

Daniels did little things like using the ropes for leverage and such. And I think the prophecy was the first to really use outside interference in any of the matches, especially during xavier's run.

 

TheGreatWhiteDope

Here is the idea for the first year-ish of ROH:

Skip all the opening bouts, outside of 1-2, watch the main event. Dragon, Low-ki, Daniels, and Joe getting hot were the only reason that place survived. Then Punk/Raven stuff started going down and ROH evolved into a more normal pro wrestling place gradually.

 

James Bullock

Like I said, the little things like that just didn't resonate with the homebase fans at the time, and actually made Daniels popular because he was one upping the "establishment". If they did with Daniels what they did with Xavier, Daniels would've been nothing short of the most hated guy in the company. Plus, he would've had better matches that the second ROH champ.

 

With moments like that, most of which came within ROH's first two years in existence, it's really a surprise they weren't just used as a developmental territory. Ironically enough, it seems like they are one now to some extent. TNA and WWE easily keep an eye on the company to grab some of their talent. From Daniel Bryan Danielson to Austin Aries all the ways down the line towards CM Punk. Luckily TNA can finally get away from that because they have acquired a development territory all their own. Ohio Valley Wrestling is now the official developmental territory of Total Nonstop Action Impact Wrestling. You may remember the name OVW as the place where Batista, John Cena, and numerous others got themselves readied for WWE's big-time. I figure someone on the message board has made a “TNA just stole another WWE thing to make itself ‘take the next step'” so I'll let them have that one.

 

Quote:

TNA IMPACT WRESTLING ANNOUNCES EXCLUSIVE TRAINING PROGRAM AT OVW Focus On Development Key To TNA

NASHVILLE, TN (November 7, 2011)– TNA IMPACT WRESTLING announces that they are entering into an exclusive relationship with Ohio Valley Wrestling (OVW), effective immediately, as the official training and developmental facility for TNA's current and future stars of TNA IMPACT WRESLTING. Former wrestling star and OVW owner Danny Davis will work closely with TNA SVP of Programming and Talent Relations Bruce Prichard in the development of the talent through training, live events, and weekly television production allowing talent to explore every aspect of the business.

"OVW is the best of the best as far as training and nurturing potential superstars. Their track record speaks for itself. Whether looking to develop brand new talent or to fine tune existing talent, OVW has the talent and program to fit our needs." says TNA's Prichard. "TNA is providing developmental talent the opportunity to hone their craft in an environment that will allow them to grow and prosper."

TNA talent will be arriving soon at the facility to begin an extensive training program with the industry's leading experts. The program is akin to a college scholarship program where talent is provided a scholarship style agreement with TNA to learn the craft. The talent to attend the program is selected by TNA's Prichard and TNA officials who will be monitoring the progress of each wrestler at camp and the live events.

TNA ENTERTAINMENT, LLC
TNA Entertainment, LLC is a privately held sports entertainment company based in Nashville, Tennessee that specializes in events, products, numerous TV properties, merchandise and music, as well as, the management and promotion of professional wrestlers. The roster features such greats as Hulk Hogan, Ric Flair, Jeff Hardy, Kurt Angle, Sting, James Storm, Ron Van Dam the lovely and lethal Knockouts and many more through its highly successful TNA IMPACT WRESTLING weekly broadcasts on SPIKE TV. In addition, TNA produces monthly PPV events and over 100 live shows a year. The product is the world's most innovative experience in professional wrestling and is broadcast in over 120 countries. For more information, please visit
www.impactwrestling.com .

 

Aaron Wood

And now we know why Cornette is with ROH full time...

 

The Green Teabagger

I don't know whether to laugh or cry or maintain my 'not-giving-a-shit' standard.

 

Mike Johns

OVW retweeted the fake TNACreative account's "announcement" -

@TNACreative

We're proud to announce our affiliation with OVW as our new developmental territory! Another ex-WWE target acquired! #WrestlingMatters



So i'd say laughing and crying are both rather appropriate

 

WeWantMoore

JC is the (so called) booker in OVW.

I think its going to like that developmental thing that TNA did before. They showed up once and nothing came from it

 

Aaron Wood

Some are wondering how TNA are affording this. Like they couldn't find $20 in cash and offer Danny Davis all the Knockout pussy he can handle...

 

Mike Johns

Does Tessmacher have to talk? Because I'd consider the deal if Tessmacher doesn't have to talk...

Also, any chance of rehiring Peyton Banks? I liked her...

 

ZAH

This is a very intriguing development for a number of reasons. At the end of the day, it's not a bad thing for anybody involved. That's not to say it'll necessarily be a GOOD thing...but it's certainly not a bad situation.

 

Sprout1883

Definitely

now if only TNA could get rid of Bischoff, Hogan, Hardy et al

 

Exx

Sounds like a good move. I never really understood why wwe dropped the territory.

 

Nasty Ned

Is it bad when your training territory is better than the stuff you put on TV....

 

Mike Johns

Already pretty much the same way it was when WWE was using them.

 

With that zinger we've reached the end of Hot Threads for the current week. I only have two pieces of advice for any of you reading this column right now:

 If you're reading this and have yet to join the World Wrestling Insanity Forums you really need to. You can join a fantastic community of people and also maybe get your thoughts put out on a website. Granted, when you post it on the forums it will be on a website...this would be a .com.

Of course, don't miss the latest of the 300 ClubWWI.com guests.  This time around it's an extremely rare interview with Marc Mero as James Guttman and Marc's former WCW co-worker Glacier interview him on the latest "Breaking The Ice."  Check it out today!

 

Until next time.....

 




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