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Hot Threads: The Pro Wrestling Rulebook, Hall of Famer Dixie Carter, The Dragon Gate USA/Evolve Union, Sin Cara's Wiener Shirt, and More

By Corey Letson Nov 28, 2011 - 8:10 AM print

It's time for another look at the free Wrestling Insanity Message Boards, with your host, "The Great White Dope" Corey Letson ...

Welcome one and all to the weekly "Best of" The World Wrestling Insanity Message Boards. Here at Hot Threads we aim to give you the cream of the crop when it comes to our fabulous residents. We'll be spending time jumping from the WWE to TNA to almost anything in the 'verse

This past week has been really unique. The Rock returned, CM Punk won the WWE Title, and Daniel Bryan (Writer's note: Every instance of Daniel Bryan in this article took about three proof-reads to get right.) “cashed-in” his Money in the Bank case which he has promised to hold until Wrestlemania. The odd thing about this is how little talk two of these three items got. For some reason people just pre-accepted The Rock and Cena at Survivor Series so people aren't talking about it. CM Punk hasn't been mentioned at all outside of the “hey he won the title, woo!” statements. Yet Daniel Bryan has stolen the momentum of them all after going for the world title this past Tuesday on Friday Night Smackdown. As a bonus: We'll slowly drift into discussing the intricacies of “The Pro Wrestling Rulebook” (Plausibly the next book by James Guttman or the entire WWI Staff?)



Aaron Wood

It's a unique move, as we've never had that happen before, but as I've said, the stipulation has been mentioned almost every time, so they haven't come up with it to screw with anyone. Thought some are going to try and suggest that.



The Green Teabagger


I can't wait for the 'burial' and 'pissing off the internet' internet remarks on Friday after that one, assuming it isn't happening already.



Peter Dawson

Daniel Bryan is the new #1 Contender. Seriously. He made Cody tap out in the 4-way. I don't even remember the last time a Money in the Bank holder got a title match that didn't involve said briefcase, if its even happened before (I think it has but I can't remember). So yeah, wrap your head around that little diddy...



The Chosen 1


MITB as #1 Contender happened one time with Edge during his first run in '05 but that was as a RAW main event as apart of bigger storylines. There's never been a hyped up PPV match with the MITB holder vs the champion.

Frankly, I'm waiting for the guy who actually wins the belt BEFORE cashing in the briefcase, or the guy who jumps the champion before a PPV Main Event as the champion is waiting for his opponent to come out..

Aaron Wood


It also happened earlier this year with Del Rio. He got a title shot on RAW with the case in his possession.
Suffice to say, to clear the confusion, the #1 contender decided on this show faces Henry on the live show in a cage match for the title and then the champion faces Big Show at TLC.




The spoilers I read made it sound more like not cause henry was knocked out but because he wasn't cleared to compete due to his injuries at the pay per view that the cash in didn't count. Which sounds ridiculous.

I assume they were testing what kind of reaction Bryan winning the belt would get.



The Chosen 1


Didn't Edge cash in on Undertaker when Taker was still laying down?



Aaron Wood


He was laid out by Henry, but they made sure Taker was up and able to consciously start the match before Edge hit a spear and won.





I thought Edge tried a cover on Taker first, but as Taker kicked out, Edge let him get up to hit the spear? Or am I confusing something?



Aaron Wood


No, you're right. Just had a look at my review, and it says Edge went for a pin and Taker kicked out (twice, actually) before Edge ended up spearing him. But it can't be denied that for a long time now, they've done the deal where the champion has to be able to defend himself.





Well it depends, lets have a look at the cash-ins which took place after the champion was attacked: Edge on Taker: No. Punk on Edge: Edge was somewhat on his feet, but referee didn't check on him. Swagger on Jericho: Referee does check on Jericho. Del Rio on Punk: Punk was never up to his feet. Del Rio kicked him while still on his knees.

Concerning the cash-ins where the champion just had a match, they always were more or less to their feet anyway, and the ref did check on them. But I did leave them out on the premise that I wanted to prove my point with scenarios that are similar to the Bryan-Henry scenario.



The Chosen 1


Just watched it, I've got to say... seeing as they're saying Henry was officiallly not cleared to compete by doctors I'd say it's a completely 100% logical and acceptable decision to say that the MITB couldn't be cashed in. I mean how can the match for the belt be scheduled if the champion is not legally (or whatever) cleared to have any type of match... it works.



I'm not Mike Johns so it is going to be a special moment here were we have a talk about WSU. The all-female wrestling organization has a Hall of Fame their very own and they've just announced their class of 2012. I'm not going to spoil one of their induction announcements for them. I'll just state that it has sparked some discussion among the WSU and WWI faithful.







Well, if they have a clueless money mark wing, She'll be the all-time headline inductee.



Mike Johns


I actually asked WSU about this on Twitter. Here's their response -

@TheMaverickMJ @tnadixie she has been invited, this is not a stunt at all, a female promoter for nearly 10 years is a feat



James Guttman


You had to ask if this was a publicity stunt?

Come on...



Mike Johns


actually, I asked if they actually expected her to show up
of course it's a stunt.



When it comes to the lengths to which Dixie Carter will go to seem legitimate, very little would shock me. If this were Stephanie McMahon or something, yeah, I'd never actually think in a billion years she'd really show. But this is Dixie. Glamour Shots in the middle of the TNA program Dixie. Hiring Hulk Hogan so she can be seen in public with him Dixie. Top trending topic on Twitter all the time Dixie.

My thing is that they seem kind of reaching to kiss Dixie's ass for some reason. Maybe it's legit, but really... all Dixie's done is be a woman who's run a company that's only still here because her family's been able to fiance it. Not exactly the kind of thing you honor, you know? "Way to go, you're just barely adequate at your job!" But, because she's a woman in a certain position, she gets honored? Sorry, that just sounds really desperate to me. You need attention that badly?

I generally like this company and all, but this is at least as desperate as Matt Hardy's
average YouTube video.



Aaron Wood


Dixie goes in before Stephanie McMahon? Bullshit. A female promoter for 10 years is a feat, sure. But a female executive and head of the writing team for about as long in the friggin' WWE ISN'T?!?! And doing it while having kids?

WSU sure as shit aimed low on this one. Like their "Hall Of Fame" means jackshit anyway.



James Guttman


I don't think Aaron was saying that Stephanie should have gotten an invite. I think he was just pointing out how ridiculous it is to honor her for an achievement that someone else has already accomplished. It makes it obvious that this was done because they're hoping she'll show up.

There's a million of these Indy Halls of Fame now. I got an inbox message for one last week and there wasn't one "inductee" that I had ever heard of - and I've been doing this for nine years. It's crazy. Just another example of Monkey See (Vince), Monkey Do (What Vince Does).



Canadian Bulldog


The crazy thing about it is, if WSU wanted publicity, they should have invited Stephanie instead. Would she have come to the ceremony? Can't imagine in a million years, but hell, it would get people talking about the McMahon family snubs everyone else.

But today's stunt is getting people talking, too. They're saying "What a stupid organization this must be".



Mike Johns


Hell, it's got otherwise big WSU fans saying that.





Who cares?





Is it any worse than WWE putting James Dudley into the Hall of Fame because he was the first black promoter to run shows and drove Vince J.'s limo? Or putting Pete Rose, Bob Uecker, William Perry and Drew Carey in?

Most people will never hear about WSU much less their Hall of Fame, but when you consider the amount of people that think WWE's is the "real" Pro Wrestling Hall of Fame and see some of their choices, Dixie Carter seems like the Mickey Mantle or Joe Montana of wrestling.



Mike Johns


From Matt Dawgs' most recent column -


WSU also announced the latest class to be inducted into their annual Hall of Fame. The late Georgian Makropoulos, Jana, Cindy Rogers, and TNA President Dixie Carter. I know Sean McCaffrey personally and I'd be shocked to see Carter showing up at the event. He hates her. LOL.


Sean owns and runs WSU, for those unaware. And, if that's the case -
Why would you want to induct someone you HATE into your HOF?! I mean, the fanbase hates it. The media's laughing at it. You guys think WSU is a joke because of it. So why do it?





Because it's a crappy indie company and a joke that everyone but you gets.

Also, he probably never even met her. So it's not like he he really has any basis for his hate, it's the same as how you hate her.



We'll be jumping from one independent promotion to another you have probably never heard of. Here is a very late welcome to the Indy Edition of Hot Threads. For the first time ever the Insanity Message Boards had a discussion about EVOLVE. What is EVOLVE you ask? Well, Mike Johns wrote a review of EVOLVE 5 (http://www.worldwrestlinginsanity.com/am2/publish/mikejohns/evolve5.shtml) a few months back and I can go over the basics quickly:


1) It is a promotion ran by Gabe Sapolsky. Former ROH booker and the current head of Dragon's Gate USA as well.

2) It is a company that cares about one thing only: wins and losses. Every match is about them and there is nothing else of importance but the wins and losses.

3) It isn't talked about or promoted to anyone outside of the people Gabe Sapolsky tells on Twitter about it.


As part of the holiday season I'm going to give Gabe Sapolsky (@BookItGabe) more promotion time for EVOLVE than he has since it's inception (which you can watch live events of at www.wwnlive.com) and we're going to feature a small discussion had on the WWI Message Board about EVOLVE and dgUSA merging.


Here's some of the details of the DGUSA/EVOLVE union:


DGUSA and EVOLVE now exist in the same universe. This means that they will share the same roster and stables.


Live events and iPPVs will still be promoted under DGUSA and EVOLVE banners. EVOLVE events will be important single shots that bridge the gap between four or five major DGUSA weekends in 2012. The happenings and results of DGUSA and EVOLVE events will have an affect on each other.


The DGUSA Champion and DGUSA Tag Team Champions will be acknowledged as the top title holders in EVOLVE. There will be possible title defenses in EVOLVE depending on the champions' availability. There is a possibility of an EVOLVE Title in 2012, which would also be defended in DGUSA.


EVOLVE will still be based on win/loss records and its leader board. You can follow these in the About EVOLVE section at DGUSA.tv. However, there will be some changes made in the structure of these as well as the rules and regulations. We'll have more info next week at DGUSA.tv. EVOLVE will still maintain its unique identity and presentation.


DGUSA and EVOLVE DVDs and merchandise can now both be purchased together in the www.DGUSA.tv Store or by calling 267-519-9744.


DGUSA.tv will be your one stop for all your DGUSA and EVOLVE news and info. DGUSA and EVOLVE will share the Live Event, News & Articles, Roster, iPPV, Report Piracy and Contact sections of DGUSA.tv. EVOLVE news will now appear here in News Alerts.


The Email News Express and WWNLive.com Email Magazine will both be the places for exclusive news, deals, articles and interviews about both DGUSA and EVOLVE. All this will be delivered right to your inbox. We will protect your email and we won't spam you.


There are now infinite possibilities with the DGUSA and EVOLVE union. We feel this will make the brands easier and more rewarding to follow. We'll have much more next week at DGUSA.tv.



Mike Johns


It's about damn time. As you guys may remember from my Summer audios on both promotions, I pretty much found EVOLVE a near waste on its own. It makes more sense to simply merge the two because fans see them as on in the same anyway. They're not going through with a full absorption into DGUSA (which I actually think would be better), but it does give EVOLVE some added purpose, and storylines, as well, which they desperately need.

Of course, how they BS their way out of the fact that Gargano & Taylor are allies in DGUSA but feuding in EVOLVE is going to be interesting, especially as Gargano is now the Open the Freedom Gate champ, and Taylor is, regardless of affiliation, his most logical main contender.





So in dgUSA wins and losses don't matter but inbetween dgUSA events in EVOLVE they are the only thing that matter. EVOLVE is purely about sporting competition where people who have blood-feuds in dgUSA will wrestle competitively for the sport of pro wrestling regardless of the hell they've put eachother through at dgUSA.

Yeah, that totally works together.



Mike Johns


Honestly, EVOLVE is almost useless. The concept has merit (all you have to do is start making wins actually matter all the time, which you should be doing ANYWAY because wins should matter in a sport), but the show is pointless. I'd rather see them absorb the resources into one show (DGUSA) but at least they're starting to realize EVOLVE is pointless.

When EVOLVE 10 got canceled, and the only real reaction to it was "meh", these guys should have figured right there that they'd be better spending the resources on improving DGUSA





I'm not disagreeing I'm just saying mixing the 2 and being like "Seriously they'll still be different, but they are totally together and the same" just doesn't work at all.



Mike Johns


For all we know, EVOLVE is more successful than the near impossibility to get people to discuss it lets on.





I'd personally highly doubt that.



Mike Johns


BY the way, this has been the only ongoing discussion of EVOLVE on this board ever. Just letting you know, as this will help make GWD's point very well





Because those of us who have taken the time to watch EVOLVE (My guess: 5-7 of the entire board) saw the shows and just didn't care. Even the ones of us that hate everything WWE, TNA, ROH, dgUSA and all others are doing right now probably like at least some entertainment. We all need characters and storylines...something EVOLVE never had.

Legit, EVOLVE wouldn't even work in the South during the 80s.



James Bullock


Count me as one of those people. I loved the idea before the first show, heard good things about it, watched the first few shows, and haven't been interested since. And since they share most of the same talent, why not merge a fledging company with one that'll never make it beyond two to three shows a month, and hardly any DVD purchases?


As always, our random and insane wrestling pics thread always brings the images.  James Guttman posted this one.  See if you can figure out what wrestler you see here.  (Go To The Message Board For The Answer...)

Posted Image

And, of course, as posted in three different threads is this picture.  Maybe WWE should stop worrying about COOs and focus on Quality Control Managers for their merchandise.  Can you spot the giant white body part that appears to be showering Sin Cara? 

Posted Image 


That does it for this week. I only have two pieces of advice for any of you reading this column right now:

If you're reading this and have yet to join the World Wrestling Insanity Message Boards you really need to. You can join a fantastic community of people and also maybe get your thoughts put out on a website. Granted, when you post it on the forums it will be on a website...this would be a .com.

(insert newest thing in ClubWWI here)


Until next time…


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